I'll make this quick -- mostly because I really don't think any lengthy expounding is required.
Tonight Joe Biden mopped the floor with Sarah Palin.
What's more, he did it by not coming right out and mopping the floor with her. Biden was cordial, eloquent and uncharacteristically restrained, choosing not to attack Palin head-on but rather to allow her style versus his substance to highlight the very clear decision that voters have in November. There wasn't one moment that I didn't fully believe that Biden is not simply the right choice for Vice President of the United States but that he could easily step into the role of president if required. He proved that he's tough, knowledgeable, experienced, quick on his feet and, most importantly, that he has a singularly keen understanding of the issues facing this country, both foreign and domestic -- an absolute necessity for anyone seeking the second highest office in the free world (one it's positively mind-boggling that some Americans are actually disputing the importance of). He just plain knocked it out of the park.
Sarah Palin, on the other hand, strung two or three complete sentences together consecutively, which means that her performance will be roundly hailed as a success. The fact, however, is that no matter how much she said or how confidently she said it -- she really didn't say much of anything. The McCain campaign handlers -- and needless to say, that's whose hand was up Palin's ass the entire time -- pulled a really neat trick by having their girl make it clear almost right off the bat that she wasn't going to answer any of those pesky questions being asked of her by moderator Gwen Ifill because, well, Ifill's part of the mainstream media and, well, Sarah Palin is a maverick. (I guess that's what mavericks do -- they don't play by the rules and answer questions, despite having agreed upon the debate format ahead of time.) What this did though was allow Palin to filibuster about anything she felt like at any given time. It allowed her to essentially give an extended speech divided into dozens of small parts rather face the danger of being tripped up by honest, unscripted interaction.
And really, the thing about Palin's performance tonight is that it was just that: a performance.
Nothing that came out of her mouth -- no inflection or movement of her body -- was unscripted.
Nothing.
Every platitude; every cliché; every wink; every robotic repetition of the McCain camp's tired talking points and, inexplicably, George Bush's failed assertions and cheap one-liners, the stuff even he doesn't bother with anymore -- it was all aimed at bringing the conservative base back on point through vacant charm and sweetly silly folksiness. It was cute to watch, even if it did make your teeth (and your brain) hurt. But it damn sure wasn't vice presidential.
Palin had no idea what the hell she was saying most of the time, but she knew she looked adorable and mildly convincing saying it.
It was almost as if she actually morphed into Tina Fey's impression of her right before our eyes, albeit a more focused and amped-up version of it.
Bottom line though, regardless what you think of the debate -- of who scored big with what and how often -- one thing is absolutely certain after tonight: there's no mistaking the choice the American voters are being given this election.
The lines are drawn more distinctly than in any race we've seen in most of our lifetimes.
Friday, October 03, 2008
Vice Work if You Can Get It
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33 comments:
Couldn't agree more and have said as much just now on my blog. Biden kicked major Moose butt. My point was that it just wasn't a DEBATE, because that would require actual discussion by both parties of the topics at hand...
I thought Senator Biden rocked. Not only did the breadth of his knowledge come through loud and clear, so did his humanity. Anyone else noticed how he briefly choked up when he talked about raising his kids following the death of his wife and daughter?
A candidate for the Vice President of the United States of America winked at the camera and later gave a "shout out." She thinks she's running for Miss Congeniality, perhaps?
Her ice-cold bitchiness when Biden talked about his family and how he GETS IT about struggling was nauseating. Obama and Biden have done triple backflips to be respectful of McCain's personal tragedy and suffering as a POW, and that cold-hearted c*** couldn't express even one moment of sympathy? What. A. Bitch.
several times during the debate i turned to my wife and said, its like she just selected sound byte number 7 and pressed PLAY, or sound byte number 3, or sound byte number 4. she had about 7 or 8 things that she just selected round-robin from her mental disc-changer.
also i found it funny the way biden would talk about some major international thing he worked on, and she would respond with some podunk thing she did in her city.
its like when you are 7 years old and your parents are talking about trading the car, and you chime into the conversation and say that you understand because you had to do the same thing with an animaniacs pog in your pog collection.
Nukular. Nukular. Nukular.
Nuf said.
Absolutely right, very much a case of substance versus style.
While it is clear that Biden is the superior candidate, and as much as I'm loath to admit it, Palin did exactly what she was supposed to do. Tomorrow the unthinking right-wing automatons will be gleefully heralding her "masterful" performance. As the rest of us look on, baffled.
one thing is absolutely certain after tonight: there's no mistaking the choice the American voters are being given this election.
I agree that the choice being given is clear; the question is, how many voters will actually make their decision based on fact, or on a set of tits and a folksy attitude? Also, Christ on a dijon-covered cracker, what was with the winking? Did she have an eyelash caught in her lower eyelid? Does she have a tic? Does she think winking at an audience like a low-rent comedian gives her an air of sincerity? It's probably the latter.
Right off the bat let's be clear: Palin lost handily to Biden in terms of being "Vice-Presidential". But she wasn't performing against Biden on "main street" (where she's from, donja know), she was performing,in the minds of pundits, republicans and common joe six-packs, against the Sarah Palin of Tina Fey and Katie Couric interviews. By this standard she beat herself. To anyone with half a mind that would be like you or I getting lauded for taking a shower without falling down.
Personally, I think she did well on those terms and I was surprised to see it. But as Chris Matthews said, it was like she was at a spelling bee. In fact, before long we will be discussing the two Palins: the one before the interviews and the one after, and contrasting them. And this contrast will work against her. Everyone knows what she sounds like off the cuff and what she sounded like when trained, and the question will be, can a vice-president who has to be coached on every single topic be acceptable. Indeed, if you rewind the debate and listen she gives four answers in all. She quotes some "facts" (and gets many wrong), but her answers are all on four topics and all the same. This will be discovered after the flush of her not choking on her own tongue wears off.
Biden sounded like he was an adult on stage with a child. He was so good he got the esoteric stuff right. On Charlie Rose Cokie Roberts said he botched the word, "bozniac" and suggested Palin would have been crucified for saying that (a common complaint about Biden's mistakes, the difference being when Biden says such things we know he knows better, but we don't know if Palin does, and suspect she doesn't). The problem with Roberts' claim is that the correct term for Muslim Bosnians IS Bozniacs. Palin wouldn't have known that.
The obvious truth I've taken away from after watching the debate three times is that Palin is no smarter, and judging by the discussions of the MSM pundits, neither are they. My hope is that the voters are.
Sorry this is so long, but I have no blog of my own and this is the only place I would even consider the comments worth adding to.
Sorry double post but I forgot to mention one thing: While Palin was playing only against herself, Biden was forced to play a much harder game; he had to make his points, not over talk and not come across as bullying a woman (not my criteria, but one definitely at play in the public). He accomplished all of them easily. Again, a cakewalk victory.
The fact that both of them agreed that there should be "no marriage for the gays", nearly made me puke. I don't care that it is a pathetic attempt to shut up the idiot-American demographic - letting people believe that marriage (as defined by the government) is anything other than a contract is just fucking obnoxious. Their argument that marriage is a sacred institution can be disproved by all of the arranged marriages, especially ones that involved dowries (or when people get remarried after a divorce). As for it being a Christian institution - does that mean all those Jews in the Old Testament were having kids outside of marriage or that when they translated it to Greek, they just didn't have a word that meant the same thing? If the government wants to bow down on the word, fine, just say everyone has a civil union, and they can get married in a church. But if we are tired and fed up with the right hijacking words, then we stand up and say "marriage means whatever we say it means, and so if two guys want to live together, have medical rights over each other, and have the right of inheritance - and they're willing to go to City Hall to get a little piece of paper - then, hey, they're married." It's called the will of the people, not the will of the whiny bastards.
Sorry, that one's been stewing for a while.
The most pathetic part of all this is people will simply say she stood her ground and held her own against Biden regardless of the fact she didn't actually answer a single question. Nor will they make note of the fact she seems to think Alaska is the only state IN the US by how much she mentioned it. And if anyone played a drinking game centered around how many times she said the god damn word "maverick" they must surely be dead or in the hospital with alcohol poisoning or at the very least a gun shot to the head. (I certainly couldn't handle her spitting out buzz words over and over and over, had to take breaks from watching)
No, sadly, I believe people are going to see this as a great showing by her and it's the RNC all over again.
A poster at TPM thinks that the winking was to straighten out a lazy eye. MSM says it was an eyelash, but they can't be trusted past the traffic report.
She's certainly trainable. She delivered one hell of a soliloquy, a bit fast and nervous, until she ran out of gas and started reading her notes.
The almost instantaneous response from the MSM seems to be that this debate will be quickly forgotten, but I think bloggers will feast on Palin's factual mistakes.
Palins handlers know that intelligent voters who may have been undecided will be aghast at the possibility of her becoming VP so they are getting her to appeal to the idiots who are still undecided. Those voters can't have much more in the way of functioning grey matter than the Alaskan Abomination herself, so as long as she smartens up a bit for them, the opinions about her performance from the informed electorate mean nothing. The right wing tabloid press will praise her enough for this encounter with Biden to secure some of those narrow minds out there for sure!
Did you see american morning today? they were in ohio asking registered republicans about the debate and acting like the fact that they all loved Palin was because she did awesome at the debate. Only briefly did they mention 'oh and we're taking comments at a party of registered republicans.' It made me crazy!! There are so many people who are 'regular middle americans' who don't just LOVE the soccer mom standing on stage. What made me even MORE nuts was how she kept talking about her struggles. give me a break! she's not regular-she got to grow up and become a beauty queen and not only go to college, but managed to go to college out of state-for crying out loud, she's anything but regular...and anyone dumb enough to want someone regular is just hanging their own noose, anyway. gah!
"Can I call you Joe?"
Give me a fucking break!!
the worst part of the debate is that early on Sarah Palin said... You know what moderator... I don't give a shit about you... I'm having my own debate.
Moderator: What are you going to go to about Sunnies and Shiites clashing?
Palin: The Human head weighs 10 pounds.
I swear to god she was spouting out facts like the doofy little Jerry McGwire kid.
What's going to happen to journalism if McCain/Palin win?
At least Bush had the decency to lie to the press.
Palin and McCain simply won't anwswer the question because they've already labeled the questioners are the elite, liberal media (which---by the way--- is republican code for the jews)... The whole thing is offensive
I watched the debate last night
GOD HELP US, SAVE US GOD
Think do you really want these people to make laws, would you follow these two into battle
I'm not smart, but its easy to spot an idiot and we have 4 wanting to be our leaders and the sad fact is 2 of them will, I;m ashame of the four, I will abstain my vote so I can live in peace as to knowing I didn't vote for an IDIOT
I can't for the life of me figure out why the more educated of the RNC will tolerate this kind of nincompoop. They tow the party line and say how great she did when they HAVE to be thinking, "man, what fucking moron."
We turned to CNBC after the debate since their opinions are fairly uncensored. Larry Kudlow WOULD NOT STOP about how Palin got Biden on Afghanistan and even had that part of the debate cued up and ready to play. Why? Because THAT'S ALL THEY HAVE!!!!
I'm so angry right now I want to puke.
About the gay marriage thing, Biden said he agrees with constitutional rights for gays just as he does heteros. He can't play priest here, marriage is a church thing, at least what I've been taught.
Was anyone a little pissed off when she called us americans Joe six-pack (again) and hockey moms? That offends me to the fullest, however she means it, I'd like to be given a little bit more credit. I'm sure guys would want it too.
Huffington Post made a point that echoed what I thought after watching the debate - Biden was in a VP debate, Palin was in a High-School debate.
This included mugging for her friends in row 9 and winking to the folks back home.
She parroted the same soundbites, said nothing of substance and scared the hell out of me. Biden showed a lot more character, and had the facts to hand.
I speak as a Brit, US taxpayer and unfortunately can't vote.
Clear win for Biden.
I started to play a drinking game based on "maverick" but gave up pretty quickly because I wanted to be coherent through the end of the debate.
I wasn't fond of either Clinton or Obama and was a bit disappointed that Edwards dropped out. During the primaries, before he started going batshit insane, I briefly considered voting for McCain. While I still haven't really warmed up to Obama, the thought of a McCain/Palin administration scares me just a bit more than a zombie apocalypse. Movies and video games have taught me how to defend myself from zombies. What's the defense against mavericks?
I have to say- I didn't understand the majority of the words coming out of her mouth. Between "Nukular" and run-on sentences that would make any grade school English teacher run for the hills, it was all a bunch of gibberish.
The obvious aside, do we really think someone with such a poor education understands the importance of education?
And as my wife says, it's insulting. If you're going to run for the office, at least show me you'll do a better job at it than I could.
And for Christ's sake, NUCLEAR! If you can't pronounce it, you shouldn't be in charge of it!
I think there's only one way to answer the most pressing question - which Sarah is the real Sarah - the doofus who can't remember the name of even one newspaper or magazine that discusses national and international issues, and who can't remember even one Supreme Court ruling except Roe v Wade? Or the confident, well-rehearsed person we saw on stage during the debate? To find out which one is real, I think David Brooks should sit down with Palin in an undisclosed location and find out if she has what it takes to keep the nation from self-destructing if she ended up as president. If he determines that she's 'ready' it won't change my mind about who I vote for, but it would help me sleep a little better.
Well, while I agree that Biden mopped the floor with her, and have to concede that she did better with her cue cards than she does in interviews with the mainstream media (they just couldn't resist putting that jab in her talking points, could they?), I think they both did their jobs.
As my room mate noted last night, there are two ways to win an election. One is to motivate more individuals who already agree with you to get off their duffs and vote. The other is to sway undecided voters.
If Palin's job is to motivate those homophobic, fundamentalist, "we don't know or care about the issues and vote on sound bites and gut reactions" folks off their cans and to the polls, I think she did a not too bad job of reaching out to them (she didn't answer any of the questions, but she may have excited some idjits).
Obama, on the other hand, already has his base motivated (as one person at our debate party noted "community organizers are good at that"). If, then, Biden's job was to reach out to those undecided voters, to those who are waiting to hear the debates and see how the candidates stack up, he performed splendidly! He actually answered the questions, which isn't going to be lost on the undecided folks that he is reaching out to. (After all, they are already thoughtful enough to say they need more data rather than going with knee-jerk emotions.) The other demographic Biden needed to reach out to are those disillusioned Hillary supporters who still carry a little resentment toward Barack (and there are too many of them here in Texas, where Hillary carried the primary votes by a wie margin and lost in the caucuses) and who might not vote at all. Depending on how deep seated their resentment is (and most of that resentment I've seen is actually more toward local party organizers at the county and state convention levels than at Obama himself, although he suffers as a result because of the resentment toward those who support him) I think Sarah Palin's inability to actually answer a question, compared to Biden's easy confidence, may have done a pretty good job of reminding them just what is at stake here and getting them to put aside their silly inter-party fighting and motivating them to go out and vote.
(Just my two cents as a Texas based Edwards supporter who caucussed for Hillary at the Travis County Convention and, of course, plans to vote for Obama.)
The moderator was limited in how she could conduct the debate but she did a terrible job.
Next, Tom Brokaw, one of McCain's biggest water carriers.
Should be interesting to see how Obama does against 2 McCains.
I used to like Brokaw as long as I could overlook the (short L) speech impediment. Not anymore. He's just another right wing MSM ass hat.
After the 17th time Palin said "Maverick", I turned to my wife and let out a ridiculous string of obscenities.
When Biden went on his tirade regarding McCain's undeserved reputation as a maverick near the end of he debate, I felt better about a VP candidate than I have in a long time.
Between that moment, and Biden completely thrashing the Palin/Cheney interpretation on a VP's constitutional role, I'd chalk up a big win in Biden's column.
Palin = Epic Fail.
The GOP trained her about as well as they could. They force-fed her some sound bites and instructed her under no circumstances to try and answer the actual questions. It was an improvement over Gibson and Couric, not because she was any more informed, but because she partially concealed her massive ignorance by darting out of answering any questions.
It doesn't look like it worked as well as it might have in times past, though. Apparently the GOP forgot that while Biden isn't the center of his campaign, he still has his own Compelling Personal Narrative. Palin's repeated trumpeting of her own family was a huge mistake. Much like how Obama anticipated McCain's hundredth use of the Grieving Mother Bracelet with his own bracelet, Biden hit back with his own history as a husband and father.
Quite frankly, it was brilliantly played out. Unlike Sarah Palin's family being dragged around like so many props, or John McCain's time as a POW, Joe Biden hadn't worn his dead wife and daughter like a flag pin the size of a Hershey bar. It was new. That one use of "champ" did more to cast Biden as a parent figure than all the finger-pointing and you betchas did for Sarah Palin.
The killer blow, though, was Biden's brief moment of choking up. Much like any android from Star Trek, Palin's greatest flaw was the inability to understand or respond to emotion. Her response, blithely echoing talking points about being a maverick, showed just how fake she really is. Any hockey mom or Joe Six-pack would have acknowledged Biden's loss. The PALINBOT-5000 didn't. Kirk would have been proud.
I want to clarify my gay marriage comment because the way I thought of it and the way it looks here is completely different.
I pretty much agree with Andrew Smash. It is, or it isn't. On a governmental and religious platform, Palin, with her quiver and all, obviously does not agree with homosexuality. But Biden, stood up there and stated that he was not the one who decided for the church, but for the government and he would give, with no doubt in his mind, no studder, no quiver, no fear, gays the same rights as the not-gays.
So yeah.
Ok this has been killing me since Palin hit the scene....Who does she remind you of when she talks?
It's Fucking Mrs Poole from the Hogan Family (an 80's sitcom for those that don't know).
"I'm gonna go for vice president don't cha know"
It's Fucking Mrs. Poole for VP.
I'm a huge fan of Biden's and I thought he did a wonderful job lastnight. He's experienced, knowledgable, genuine, and I trust him 100%. He's the real deal. Sadly, I wish it were a Biden/Biden ticket, though.
(Your critique of Palin's performance was a good one)
Throughout the entire debate, she looked and sounded like she was answering the final question in the Miss Alaska State Pageant. Did anyone notice that, at one point, she said "...Barack Obama and Senator Obiden..."?
P.S. I think Joe Six-Pack was a contestant on the second season of I Love New York.
During last week's debates, McCain behaved like a pompous ass and Obama took the high road. So last night I think I was most excited by the whole thing where Biden danced along the line of smiling Palin's way and maintaining a cordial, even friendly, demeanor while laying it on the line, facing straight into the camera, and exposing McCain the Maverick for the overblown dictator wannabe that he is. I swear to God, I heard angels singing. And before last night, I really just didn't know much about him (Biden). Spent the rest of last night and most of today reading and finding out more. If other people, Conservatives specifically, were spending some time reading and find out more, what would they think of their choices? In my case, Biden just reinforces all of Obama's assets, creating a truly powerful voice for change. On the other side, it's just more of the same, same, same.
I'd love to be able to support a woman for vice president. But Palin just reinforces all the old sexual stereotypes by acting just so goshdarn precious. She reinforces what's wrong with a strictly Conservative viewpoint by playing to it in such a way that the old Republicans sounds like finally and truly what they are -- a bunch of rednecks. She's an embarrassment to our intelligence.
Sarah Non Sequitur skirts ultra-right domestic diet program.
** Super-size me Jesus! This is your mind on junk-food faith **
Palin is Peter Pan, a never-grow-up tomboy. How else to characterize a mental and behavioral juvenile who opines that human beings and dinosaurs walked together in a world at most 6,000 years old. Abandon rationality and honesty if you would be one with her in holy-fundie-land.
Zealots want a theocratic America -- an *Ameristan*, complete with puritanism and fanaticism -- they will forgive her handlers' subterfuges. After all, she's a lying shill for dominionism.
We know exactly what Sarah Palin reads -- They’re bible commentary mags filled with Dobson and Hagee’s theology of hatred. They’re her source for law and morals, domestic and foreign policy, war strategy and negotiating tactics.
Fundies hate what the US is becoming. They will not tolerate an open society, a pluralist culture, or a secular state. Christian fideists, just like Islamic fideists, demand racial “purity,” male dominated social control, subjugation of women, unquestioned acceptance of religious tyranny. Not by those labels of course.
Palin has tried to conceal her own warped desire for bringing to fruition Margaret Atwood’s wretched dystopia stripped bare in her novel, The Handmaid’s Tale.
Millions far saner than Sarah still do not know what's in her mind . . . unenlightened beliefs caused by thoughtless consumption of junk-food faith. Super-size me Jesus!
bipolar2 ©2008
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